This post is linked to Allergy-Free Wednesday and Gluten-Free Wednesday.
Disclaimer: Please understand that I, and others whose advice is cited here, have no expertise when it comes to your personal medical issues. Some who are quoted here do serve as medical professionals, but they have no knowledge of your specific medical needs and situation. Please consult your own health care professionals for medical guidance as needed.
This image and all other thermography images are courtesy of VA Clinical Thermography.
UPDATE: This giveaway is now closed. Congratulations to gail and Andrea (Andrea’s Kitchen) who each won a copy of my friend Kelly Brozyna’s popular The Spunky Coconut Dairy-Free Ice Cream Cookbook! Thanks to all who entered and participated in this month’s GFE VSG. Subscribe to gfe (via reader or email), so you don’t miss the next meeting, linky, and giveaway, or any post. 🙂
If Ocktoberfest can be held in our neighboring city of Fredericksburg when it’s still September, then I can have my September GFE Gluten-Free Virtual Support Group (VSG) on the first day of October, right? I don’t know about yours, but our September just flew by. It could have been that week of vacation that Mr. GFE and I took. We traveled all over Pennsylvania and to the Finger Lakes region of New York and my focus was on relaxing, so I was not online much. It was a wonderful and relaxing time! If you’re wondering about the scheduling of my GFE VSG posts in general, I gave up posting on my “planned” day long ago. I just share the info from out last “real life” gluten-free support group meeting when I can, which turns out to be *about* once a month!
This month’s meeting started like all our others, that is, with another wonderful gluten-free (and more-free) meal of whole foods and recipes made from whole foods. For our presentation, we were fortunate to have Eleina-Hayes Espigh of VA Clinical Thermography with us to educate us on the benefits of thermography. While this topic has no direct relation to celiac and non-celiac gluten sensitivity/gluten intolerance, it is just good info for all and you may see some of your own conditions and symptoms mentioned in Eleina’s presentation later on, ones which might have been impacted by eating gluten and/or resolved on a gluten-free diet. (There were several times during her presentation that she cited a condition shown in an image and my support group members “sang,” almost in chorus, “that’s gluten!”)
The Food ~ Arugula Salad (with walnuts, parmesan, and a dressing made of olive oil, lime juice, lemon juice, and Dijon mustard); my group’s favorite salad—Great Salad; Baked Swai (with olive oil, onions, garlic, and Old Bay); Chicken Burgers (made with minced chicken, macadamia nuts, cashews, garlic, egg whites, etc.)—recipe from Sandra Ramacher’s Healing Foods: Cooking for Celiacs, Colitis, Crohn’s and IBS (a cookbook that follows the Specific Carbohydrate Diet); homemade Chicken Salad; Roasted New Potatoes and Brussels Sprouts (also included olive oil, bacon, butter, salt, pepper, lemon juice, and shallots); Green Pea and Onion Salad (frozen green peas, cocktail onions, tomatoes, olive oil, salt, pepper, and garlic powder); Black Bean Dip (black beans, ginger, olive oil, Herbamare, and lemon juice) with carrot sticks; watermelon; and grapes. We had a dessert and ice cream social after our meal. The baked goods were Banana Nut Muffins (paleo; recipe from Free Fit Guy); Sponge Cake Muffins (SCD); Apple Crumble (paleo; recipe from Caveman Strong); and Peach “French Toast” Cobbler (a recipe using Rudi’s gluten-free Cinnamon Raisin Bread that I’m still perfecting). And for ice cream, we enjoyed Butter Pecan Ice Cream (from The Spunky Coconut Ice Cream Cookbook); my Caramel Coconut Chunky Monkey ice cream; and my Snickerdoodle ice cream. All were dairy free! There were Goldbaum’s Ice Cream Cones (gluten free, kosher, vegan, and GMO free) available for those who didn’t want their ice cream in a dish. We also enjoyed fresh lemonade; iced tea (“sweet” tea and Good Earth Sweet and Spicy Tea, which contains on sweeteners, but is plenty sweet on its own due to the spices and other natural ingredients used).
Getting Ready … Note Copy of Brand New Practical Paleo by Diane Sanfilipo on Counter
Butter Pecan Ice Cream from The Spunky Coconut Dairy-Free Ice Cream Cookbook
Butter Pecan Ice Cream from The Spunky Coconut Dairy-Free Ice Cream Cookbook Quickly Disappeared!
The Presentation ~ Eleina Hayes-Espigh from VA Clinical Thermography was our guest speaker. VA Clinical Thermography’s goal is “Disease Prevention and Injury Detection through thermal imaging of breast and body.” Here are some highlights from her presentation on Clinical Applications of Digital Infrared Thermal Imaging (DITI), which is more commonly referred to by us lay people as thermography. Plus, I’ve added some amplifying information from online research of my own.
Sir William Herschel, a German astronomer, first observed thermography in 1800. Sir John Herschel, his son, made the first thermal image, called an evaporograph, in 1840. The first thermal image for medical purposes did not happen until 1948 and that scan took much longer than it does today.
In thermography, there is no radiation and no touching required, the camera detects the thermal radiation from the person’s body. Thermal radiation can be a bit of a confusing term as it’s not radiation in the sense we know it. In simple terms, “Radiation is energy that comes from a source and travels through some material or through space. Light, heat and sound are types of radiation.” In this case, the thermal “radiation” refers to the heat from the patient’s body.
There are normal thermal patterns and abnormal thermal patterns. Abnormal thermal patterns can be indicative of injury and/or disease. Changes in thermal patterns can indicate impending disease or progression of treatment. FDA-approved, clinical grade cameras are used. Thermography is a test of physiology, not anatomy. It is not an independent diagnostic tool; it is used to supplement other diagnostic methods (e.g., mammography, physical examinations). The colors of thermal images are changeable and may be used to provide easier-to-read images, but thermal patterns are not changeable for viewing. And, again, it bears repeating that thermal images are used to validate pain or injury, to differentiate between pain and disease, and to monitor treatment progress. Thermography uses hypothermia and hyperthermia shown in images. Hyperthermia indicates an elevated body temperature. It occurs when the body produces or absorbs more heat than it can dissipate. Hypothermia occurs when an one’s temperature drops below that required for normal metabolism. We think of hypothermia as being of extreme severity, like when one is exposed to freezing temperatures for an extended period of time, but hypothermia like hyperthermia can be more subtle, but still serious, and can be shown in different parts of the body via thermography.
Eleina stated that:
“Clinical thermography is just a simple test of physiology that relies on the sympathetic nerve control of skin blood flow and the ability of the sympathetic system to respond and react to pathology anywhere in the body.”
Thermography is especially appropriate for women between 30 and 50 because their denser breast tissue makes it harder for mammograms to pick up suspicious lesions. Thermography provides a clinical marker that a specific area needs particularly close examination/further investigation.
Early Detection for Breast Cancer is Key; Cancer Cells Double Every 90 Days (Per VA Clinical Thermography)
Eleina emphasized throughout the presentation that only American College of Clinical Thermology (ACCT) certified-technicians should be used by patients. She cautioned that there are those who do thermography who are not skilled and not licensed. A licensed technician and licensed physician, both licensed for thermography by ACCT, are required. Note that it is the physician who always reads and interprets the images.
The majority of Eleina’s patients—and these include both females and males—see her for thermography of their breasts. Per information shared at Carolina Thermascan, researchers at Ville Marie Breast and Oncology Center, at McGill University (Ontario, Canada), conducted a study of mammography and thermography. “When thermography was performed on patients with suspicious clinical examinations, the sensitivity was found to be 83%. In contrast, the sensitivity for mammography was only 66%. However, the combination of thermography and mammography together increased the sensitivity to 93%. And when these two methods were considered in conjunction with a clinical examination of the breasts, the sensitivity was found to be 98%. Such findings, along with those of more recent studies, have led a growing number of oncologists to recommend the combination of mammography and thermography—especially for older women who have more fatty tissue in their breasts, i.e., less dense breasts. (Note: “Sensitivity” is a statistical term referring to the percentage of women who are correctly identified as having breast cancer.)” You can see more details on that study here in a PDF.) On January 29, 1982, the FDA published its approval of thermography as an adjunctive diagnostic procedure for the detection of breast cancer.
Eleina showed us dozens of different images showing a wide range of illnesses and conditions. Inflammatory breast cancer. Colon blockages. Thyroid conditions. Kidney inflammation. Interstitial cystitis. Pelvic inflammatory disease. Carotid artery blockages. Back pain. Stomach pain. Ductal Carcinoma In Situ (DCIS). Carpal Tunnel Syndrome. Deep Vein Thrombosis (DVT). Peripheral Neuropathy. Injuries from motor vehicle accidents (e.g., collapsed sternum). Bells palsy. Fibromyalgia. Botox treatments. Encapsulated cysts. Sprained ankles. Stress fractures. Sometimes when using thermography for one issue, she sees others; such as thyroid issues and carotid artery blockages. She, of course, reports such information so further diagnostic testing can be conducted.
Bell’s Palsy Image
Carotid Artery Blockage
Neuropathy of Right Hand
Eleina was asked if she recommended thermography over mammography as mammography actually employs radiation, which is a known cause of cancer. She stated that she would never make such a recommendation, but acknowledged the concern for those at high-risk for breast cancer being exposed to radiation via more frequent mammograms than the average person. My own doctor, specifically my gynecologist who has presented to my support group previously (for the VSG post on his presentation, click here), recommends both mammography and thermography to provide a more complete picture.
Breast Cancer, Ductal Carcinoma In-Situ (DCIS)
Eleina talked about a friend who was a doctor who had had a shoulder injury and subsequent surgery. He used thermography via her clinic to monitor his progress. With thermography it was determined that he was overcompensating initially, and later the images showed that he had developed an infection.
One of the most compelling series of images she showed chronicled the effects of acupuncture (see below).
Eleina stated that in other countries, thermography is done routinely when patients are admitted to hospitals for medical issues. In U.S., it’s considered an invasion of privacy. We all became very interested when Eleina stated the following:
“Focal hypothermia (i.e., localized “heat”) over both T1/T2 vertebrae is shown in 100% of patients who have autoimmune diseases.”
I think we were all wanting a thermography of the area of our T1/T2 vertebrae area right then. My question: Could thermography be another tool used to help identify those with autoimmune diseases?
Focal Hypothermia over T1 / T2 for Those with Autoimmune Conditions
Thermography can also be used to evaluate animals. In addition to being used in some veterarinary clinics for pets, it’s often used for highly valued animals like racehorses (to assess ability to safely perform) and zoo animals (when standard animal knowledge may not be enough). Eleina stated that the cameras used for animals are different than those used for people.
I have had thermal imaging myself, on my breasts, to acquire additional clinical information. I am one who has historically had dense, fibrocystic breasts with periodic callbacks for second mammograms, follow-up ultrasounds, and even a biopsy in one case. Each time, in the end, I was told there was nothing of concern, but I wanted to gain additional information on my breast health via thermography. So I had investigated the benefits of thermography at that time, but I still learned a tremendous amount from Eleina’s presentation. Group members also found this information very worthwhile. I hope you have, too. If you’re a local person, you can find the VA Thermography Clinic in Glen Allen, Virginia. Check out their website and Facebook page. Eleina has offered a significant discount for VA Thermography’s services for my local support group members (contact me if you’re a local member who is interested).
The Giveaway ~
I have not yet purchased Kelly’s (The Spunky Coconut) new cookbook, The Spunky Coconut Dairy-Free Ice Cream Cookbook, but it only took one bite of her Butter Pecan Ice Cream recipe to convince me that this latest book of hers is another “must have.” (Thanks to my support group member Megan for making this ice cream for us all!) One member said that she didn’t even like Butter Pecan Ice Cream usually, but she loved Kelly’s version. It was definitely gourmet quality ice cream. You can read other complimentary reviews of Kelly’s new book (some that include her recipes, and others that share dairy-free ice cream recipes that she inspired) from Alisa, Lexie, Elana, and Stacy and Matt (here and here). Now the part you really want to know … Two readers will each win a copy of Kelly’s Dairy-Free Ice Cream Cookbook courtesy of gfe. The giveaway will end Sunday, October 7, at midnight Eastern.
To enter the giveaway:
–Leave a comment on what you’d bring to our support group meeting, why you’d like to win Kelly’s cookbook, any experience you’ve had with thermography, etc. … basically anything to contribute to our virtual support group meeting.
For additional entries:
–Share this VSG post on Facebook or Twitter. Leave a comment.
—Follow gfe on Facebook. Leave a comment.
The Linky ~ We did not have a food theme for this particular meeting, but in keeping with the food we always share at our meetings and following the gfe approach, please link up any of your gluten-free whole foods/real food recipes (maximum of two)! The giveaway will end Sunday, October 7, at midnight Eastern. Bloggers, please enter linky with your recipe below—please link back to this VSG post and thanks for joining in!
I’d probably bring a butternut squash pasta dish. I LOVE ICE CREAM, that’s why! I’ve never heard of thermography for the body, but we use it in the building industry all the time to diagnose problems such as leaky exteriors (air or water), missing insulation, and find mold within wall enclosures.
Hi Anne–You would make everyone very happy by bringing a butternut squash pasta recipe! Yep, good ice cream is a LOVE-worthy thing.
How interesting on thermography being used in the building industry. Makes sense!
Too late for the linky, but I posted that butternut squash pasta dish in my inaugural blog post!
I have shared on facebook.
I follow on facebook.
I have subscribed via RSS.
Shirley, this is an excellent post about thermography. I wish I had read it a couple of years ago because I went to a clinic that offered thermography in March of 2011. I had the full body thermogram at that time and then they had me come back in 90 days for a breast only thermogram to establish a baseline. I had not had a mammogram for several years and the attending doctor knew that. My results came back with some hot spots on both breasts but the written report said they believed I was fine and that the hot spots were just my dense breasts. I even asked the tech who performed the test if a mammogram was ever used in addition or as a follow up. She said “no”. I even paid extra to go over the results with the clinic doctor because I was afraid my gynecologist would not have enough knowledge to interpret the results correctly.
This July I was diagnosed with breast cancer and a month ago I had a double mastectomy. My pathology came back with 3 tumors in one breast and 1 in the other.
I think thermography is a great tool if used correctly but I wish the clinic that I went to had insisted I have a mammogram at the same time for a baseline. It would have saved me a years growth of my cancer and maybe it wouldn’t have gone to my lymph nodes too.
Knowledge is power and I obviously didn’t have enough at the time to know that the clinic I went to was bad.
Andrea – so sorry to hear about your diagnosis. There are certainly levels of care in any type of medical practice. A tip off might be that we don’t refer to anything in your thermogram as a “hot spot” because “hot” would be relative, and it’s not about the spots but more about the patterns and progression.
Andrea–My heart goes out to you, dear. I know we chatted by email earlier, but I had no idea of these other factors that you’ve shared. Thank you for being willing to share your personal story with that very cautionary info here. I think we should all get second opinions/additional testing when we have a “feeling”/want more data, etc. The good medical professionals are always open to additional testing and second opinions. Things are much easier to see in hindsight though. Always. And, of course, you are so right about knowledge being power. Sending you all good and healing thoughts and prayers, Andrea.
i would bring gluten-free chips and dip
gail–That’s a classic dish to share and would be great for our meeting if made of real food. Like black bean dip. Yum. 😉
Thanks for joining in!
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Megan @ Allergy Free Alaska says
Very interesting post, Shirley. Thank you for taking the time to write this down to share with all of us – and thank you Eleina! I don’t think I’ve ever heard of thermography before. I’d be incredibly interested in having it done down the road to check for inflammation and degeneration (in my whole body). I’ll have to keep it in mind… now you have me wondering if my insurance would pay for it? I will have to look in to it more. 🙂
I’ve shared 2 recipes today – my refined sugar free kimchi and the bacon wrapped dates stuffed with goat cheese. Yum!
As always, thank you for hosting!
ps- I want some of that butter pecan ice cream – it looks FAB!
Some insurance companies cover it. But you won’t see bone degeneration with thermography, I’m sorry to say. What we will see is arthritis, though.
Hi Megan–Thanks so much for the kind feedback! I think it could provide very interesting data for you. I use my health care flexible spending account to pay for thermographys. Not sure if you have one of those. They are wonderful! And I really appreciate you sharing your recipes on the linky! 🙂
Kelly’s Butter Pecan recipe is beyond good!
Megan @ Allergy Free Alaska says
I forgot to mention, no need to enter me in the giveaway – just wanted to leave you a note!
Thanks for another interesting and informative post Shirley. I’m not sure how common thermography is in Canada, but the combined stats on thermography and mammography are very encouraging.
Your monthly meeting and all that food look amazing. I love Butter Pecan ice cream, so I’m sure that this would be wonderful. I just finished reading the Babycakes cookbook (from the library) filled with all kinds of GF baking. Yum!
About as common as they are in the US, and maybe even moreso because the thermographers I know in Canada all work in hospitals!
Thanks, Susan. I’m glad that Eleina weighed in on how prevalent thermography is in Canada.
You’d love that butter pecan ice cream! And lots of folks are Babycakes fans. 😉
I would have a hard time picking what I would bring….I love to share food so much that multiple dishes would be in tow!
I love Kelli, and her other two cookbooks ar favorites…in fact ome of her ice cream recipes are TOPS here, what a treat to get a. Copy!
I have never heard of thermo is going, but my curiosity,is totally peaked now, as a melanoma survivor, you can’t have too much info, and this look really interesting.
Tessa–We would NEVER turn away your multiple dishes! Yes, check into thermography; it can be a valuable tool.
This is very interesting. I’m not familiar with thermography. I have the same situation as you as far as mammograms go. I will look into this more.
As I was adding my link I had the thought that I may not have linked back to you last month, but I don’t remember what recipe I linked up. Sorry about that if I didn’t.
Hi Linda–I do think thermography is a great tool, especially for those of us who have these types of breasts and callbacks.
Well, I didn’t notice the link missing, and thank you for sharing a recipe in this month’s linky!
I have heard of thermography and this has moved me again to do more research. even though it isn’t gf specific it relates to whole body health. thanks for the info.
Hi Dawn–Thanks! We have a wide variety of topics at our support group meetings, and I do hope they contribute to the overall health of everyone attending. 🙂
Kate @ Eat, Recycle, Repeat says
I love these virtual support groups! The in-person ones look like such an amazing community gathering. You guys are getting nourished on so many levels. I’ve heard nothing but rave reviews about Kelly’s book ~ I’d love a copy! Thanks for the info on another form of holistic health.
Hi Kate–Thanks so much, dear! I love your snacky dessert that you linked up, and you’ll love Kelly’s ice cream. 🙂
Ina Gawne says
Shirley – this is so fascinating. I have never heard of thermography before. What an amazing way to discover a multitude of health issues without invasive procedures. I am also a huge advocate of Acupuncture and have often recommended it to clients with chronic pain, or soft tissue damage.
I love love the food at your gatherings. It puts a smile on my face…and actually makes me want to dive right in! Thanks for sharing – such great information and amazing looking food!
Diane Eblin- thewholegang says
Wow that is really interesting info on the thermography. Thanks for sharing that.
Diane–It’s interesting to find out how many folks don’t know about thermography. I learned about it maybe 7 years ago and had one a few years back. It’s a fascinating tool.
Laura's Gluten Free Pantry says
What a fascinating post with very helpful information. That cookbook of Kelly looks divine. And if you know me, I am slightly obsessed with homemade dairy-free ice cream 🙂 I linked up a Grain-Free Macaroon recipe this month.
Hi Laura–Thanks! Being slightly obsessed with homemade dairy-free ice cream is a very good thing in my opinion. I just wish all my dairy-free ice cream maker friends lived closer. 😉
Thanks so much for linking up your macaroon recipe, too. 🙂
I’d love to win Kelly’s book – I have one of her others and enjoy it tremendously. My family always wants ice-cream so I’d like to have a bunch of healthier options to try for them. Thanks!
Hi Brandae–This would be the perfect book for you and your family! 🙂
I’d bring my absolutely amazing low-carb paleo chocolate cake. It’s basically a bastardization (bc I had different chocolate and added way too much of it!) of Paleo Mom’s nut-free chocolate cupcake recipe that turned out delicious!
I’d love to win because I love ice cream but I’ve only gotten to eat it once in the last year. Some recipes would be very much appreciated!
Thanks for the info on Thermography. Any ideas why we auto-immuners have issues at that joint?
Hi Monique–I know we’d all enjoy your cake! Thank you so much for sharing your recipes.
Once in the last year is definitiely not enough for homemmade ice cream. 😉
Oh, and that’s a good question on the T1 / T2 autoimmune connection. I hope Eleina will weigh in no that.
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-Monique C. M.
I would love to have this cookbook. We miss ice cream so much at our house! If I could travel across the country to your support group, I’d bring your amazing Bacon Chicken recipe! (Is that cheating?) Always requested on Sunday nights at my house.
I posted this to my facebook page!
I follow you on facebook! (Thank Goodness! All my best stuff comes from you or someone you link to!)
Amy M says
Thanks for the giveaway. I think I’d bring potato salad to a gf potluck. Actually, I’m going to one today and finally decided that is what I will bring because I have a lot of new potatoes from the garden! I did have a thermo scan once for a screening at a chiropractor office. Never went further with it, but interesting. I was in a lot of pain that day and expected to see a lot of red in my back, but there was none. I was surprised how it worked.
I also subscribe to the feed!
Amy M says
I follow gfe on facebook.
Thank you for this information about thermography… I have been looking for a practitioner in my area.
We have some dairy free people in our house and have been trying some homemade ice cream recipes… would love to try some out of this book….
Thanks for all your valuable info.
Great post! I have never heard of thermography as a diagnostic tool. I’m very glad I read this as I have 3 Celiacs & a non-celiac gluten sensitive (all with multiple severe nutrient deficiencies) & I have Hashimoto’s Thyroiditis along with a strange cervical cancer ‘issue’. I want to get all 5 of us imaged!!!
I think we would bring my daughter’s GF+ Pink Lemonade Cake & some delicious honey energy bars for everyones ride home. :0)
Ty for your great information!
Already follow you on facebook! 🙂
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shared on twitter! 🙂
I have shared on FB
I already follow gfe on FB and subscribe via email
I had never heard of Thermography, very interesting. I definitely wish I could get this down but being in the military, they won’t pay for it. Everyone in my house loves ice cream and would love to try the different flavors in this book!
Megan Lierman says
I’d bring gluten/egg/dairy free baguette with a hot spinach artichoke dip or some other comfort food like that.
Very interesting information on thermography. I would bring some amazing “Easy Brazilian Cheese Bread” or Pão de Queijo made with tapoica starch. Authentically it is made with sour manoic starch. I find mine at an Asian grocer (in Chandler, AZ) who has aisles of world products “because the world doesn’t fit on one aisle”.
Kari S. says
I would bring my mocha chocolate chunk cookies. They are gluten, soy, dairy, egg, corn, rice, and nut free and made with coconut oil 🙂
Kari S. says
I follow GFE on Facebook. Karibeth Myers Soto
Kari S. says
I shared this on Facebook. Karibeth Myers Soto
Jessica P says
I would love to win the cookbook! I have a few dairy free ice cream recipes, but all the reviews/recipes I’ve seen from her look absolutely FABULOUS!!! It’s so nice to have other people to share allergen friendly recipes with!
I would bring my cannelli bean and roasted garlic salad…eating that now, enjoying it gobs!
I really appreciate this post. I’ve heard of themography and don’t know much, but it’s very much a topic of interest and quite timely for me.
SunnyB @ andloveittoo says
So much interesting information, Shirley! Thank you for sharing.
I’m bringing my Coconut Flour Apple Crumble. Delicious, easy and made for a crowd. Perfect for your event! xo
Steamed kabucha squash is what I would share. It’s naturally sweet and creamy.
What an amazing post. You always offer such wonderful information!! I’m sorry to miss this month’s potluck, but I look forward to sharing next month for sure! I’m featuring this amazing post on AFW this week.
That was really fascinating. Thanks so much for sharing all of this about thermography. I know of one doctor who does it in my city, and I have been debating going to her (cost) and I definitely want to now. Very interesting. Also, I would loooove to win Kelly’s book! Dairy-free ice cream is one of my favorite treats!
This stuff is fascinating and I totally want to get a whole body scan just to see what I look like in heat pictures. 🙂
A very interesting and informative post about Thermography which made me google the subject to see if it is available in the UK because we all hate mammograms, don’t we?
As I expected, thermography is not considered, despite the improvements over the past few years which have significantly improved its accuracy, to be a reliable tool. But, as you mentioned, I think there is great benefit to be achieved from using both practices in the early detection of cancer.
Oh and BTW the food sounds awesome – especially the black bean dip, you know I love black beans!
I’m so excited to find out that I won The Spunky Coconut Dairy-Free Ice Cream Cookbook! I have known for quite a few years that dairy is not my friend and luckily there are some fun alternatives to use instead when making ice cream. I can’t wait to play with Kelly’s recipes!
Thanks so much for the cookbook!